• Nick
  • Nick
  • Carsonic
  • PiperAR

    Anybody wonder if Denver got a better offer from a team that wasn’t Talib’s preferred NFC destination? 😉

    • MattR

      If they did, it was not a significant difference. I can see Elway taking 160 from the Rams over 150 for the Packers but I think Elway would prioritize the Broncos over sentiment if the difference in offers was much bigger than that. (You can argue that there is some value to the Broncos in hooking Talib up, since it may encourage future free agents to come here but I don’t think that would be a huge factor which is why I think Elway would only make minor concessions to get Talib to a preferred destination)

      • gnasses

        Could also be a nod to Talib’s agent Todd France. Not a huge name but clients include Fletcher Cox, Demaryius Thomas, Marcell Dareus

      • PiperAR

        Broncos took a little less from the Jets vs a pick earlier in the fourth round from Jax to put Tebow with the team he wanted.

        • MattR

          That is pretty much exactly what I mean. The 6th vs 13th pick in the 4th round is not significant so I am not shocked that Denver was willing to accept either (since it came with the good will and positive PR from letting Tebow pick his spot).

          Interestingly, Denver still ended up with Jacksonville’s 4th round pick that year (via Tampa as part of the trade down that eventually yielded Derek Wolfe)

  • Sparks

    I expect to get burned for this, but I’ll put this out there anyway. 🙂 A lot of talk has been centered around the Broncos going after Keenum, especially if they lose out on the Cousins sweepstakes. I had said earlier this week that we already have a poor man’s Keenum on the roster in TS. My thoughts are that after his 2017 season Keenum might get ~$20M APY. TS is at $2M this year. It got me thinking what is better:

    – Keenum $20M
    – TS – $2M, LaAdrian Waddle $1.2M, Josh Sitton $7M, Malcolm Butler $4M, Isaiah Crowell $3M (or even Blount at $1.2M), Avery Williamson $4M

    For this discussion, I’m leaving rookies out of it and just focusing on FA’s. I ‘m praying for them to get Nelson and that would negate the need to get a Sitton, for instance.

    Now, I’m not necessarily advocating these exact players or dollars, just giving some examples of how that potential $18M difference can be spent by not going after a guy that, until this last year had comparable or worse stats than TS. I know the continuation of this logic, then, would be exchanging Cousins for Keenum and putting a larger dollar figure next to it. IMO, Cousins is much superior to Keenum, though, and would justify the dollars. Cousins has been a Top 5-10 QB for 3 years running and those type players get paid.

    • bradley

      I agree. Trevor gets a lot of undeserved grief here. But last year was just a mess and I blame the coaches, not TS.

      Siemian through 9 starts compares well to NFL’s best
      Tom Brady and Drew Brees were 6-3 after nine NFL starts. Trevor Siemian is 7-2.

      http://www.9news.com/article/sports/nfl/denver-broncos/mike-klis/siemian-through-9-starts-compares-well-to-nfls-best/355058760

      • BlackKnigh

        I blame the coaches as well. They had TS throwing way too many passes when they should have been balancing the attack with run plays. YOu put your guys in a position to win.

    • T. Jensen

      I agree – as much as it sucks to not have a great QB and roll with lesser talent. It sucks even more to overeact and reach for a decent QB that costs way too much.

      Keenum is not a great QB – I would be perfectly happy signing him for less than $10 million per year any more than that and you are wasting money IMO. He couldn’t get a talented Vikings team over the hump last year, what makes us think he’d get the Broncos over the hump?

      I feel the same about signing Cousins. Any more than $20 million is too much IMO.

      • bradley

        I’m not real down on Keenum for the loss to the Eagles – it was just the Eagles year.

        • Steven Searls

          My feeling about Keenum is that Shurmer as his OC did a great job playing to his strengths and covering for his weaknesses. Plus he had two outstanding wideouts in Diggs and Theilen, plus Rudolph at TE. And, of course, they had a very solid defense (until they ran into Philly in NFC championship game). Not sure how he would do with a new coordinator and new system. He certainly isn’t worthy of $20M APY.

        • T. Jensen

          No it certainly is not his fault but a better QB could have possibly done more. I just feel last year was his ceiling and it wasn’t that high. Certainly not $20 million high.

          • cjfarls

            I think folks that say Keenum’s level of play last was not worth $20m completely underestimate how important competent QB play is, as well as how scarce competent QB play is.

            I’ve posted before that I think QB play explains 30-40% of the variation in W-L outcomes… a.k.a., if I tell you which QB played better in a game, you can know absolutely nothing about the rest of the teams and be able to predict who won ~40% of the time.

            That is simply HUGE. It means the rest of your team could be the best in the NFL at every single position, and if your QB plays worse than the opposition, you lose 60% of the time, or if you have consistently the best QB in the league, you may win up to 40% of your games even if the rest of your team is absolutely terrible. Maybe I over-inflate that value after years of watching Elway/Manning take otherwise mediocre teams to 12-win seasons (both QBs I’d guess were worth 5 extra wins per year to their teams)… but I’ve also seen too many seasons sunk by bad QB play to discount the importance of the position.

            Getting a league average (16th ranked) or better QB play is hugely valuable – far more than $20m in terms of on field performance. I wouldn’t pay $20m for the 30th ranked QB, but even mediocre QB play is insanely valueable. The fact that a team might pay only 10-20% of the cap for up to 40% of the variation to me says QBs, even the average ones, are vastly UNDERPAID. Basically, for consistently competent QB play (top-15 level), I don’t think 15+% of the cap is too much. It really is that important.

            The risk on Keenum is he’s only been at that “competent” level one year. He could easily be at the 20th or wrose QB next year again. To me that says that the guarantee in 2019 is far more important than the salary in 2018. He’s worth $20m in 2018… but if he regresses to his mean, you don’t want to pay him that in 2019. That was the problem with the Flacco contract… he didn’t provide competent play for the big salary. In contrast, for all the handwringing on Dalton’s $16m/year (less than $20m now in cap-inflated dollars)… in hindsight, not many people are calling that a terrible contract. Dalton’s problem is he’s paid about right for being the 20th best QB… and the 20th best QB won’t take the team far unless the rest of the team is better than average.

          • PiperAR

            It is NOT about not understand the importance of QB play and the scarcity of QBs. It IS about understanding the risk on the other side of the strait, of paying too much for middling talent.

            By all means steer your ship clear of Scylla, but don’t ignore Charybdis either, or your ship will get sucked under. I think Scylla is the less risky of the two because she will eat a few sailors, but Charybdis will pull your whole ship to the bottom. Avoiding overpriced QBs is less risky because it keeps your options open. Overpaying a QB means if that QB goes down, they take the whole team with it.

          • cjfarls

            Sure. I did say I’m not keen on multi-year risk for Keenum. If Keenum ends up sucking, I want to be able to move on.

            But salary risk isn’t just for QBs. There is no guarantee spending that money on other positions is any less risky (e.g., see Stephenson/Watson). Because of the impact of QB play, I’d rather swing for the fences there (with the ability to move on if we strike out) than bunt every play.

          • T. Jensen

            I guess just don’t see Keenum as a swing for the fence move. But I do agree with the not bunting all the time sentiment.

          • Alaskan

            A reference to a Homer other than Simpson. Impressive.

      • Sparks

        If they don’t get Cousins, they should turn to Bridgewater/McCown and the draft. I just have a hard time seeing any other FA QB being worth the lost opportunity costs. The Broncos would do better just taking their chances in the draft.

    • DCJ1

      Getting Keenum is not an upgrade over TS, and probably not over Brock. I know this is an unpopular opinion in much of Broncoland, but the QB problems last year were only 50% on the QBs. Over-paying Keenum and bringing him into the same situation would be like the mistake Houston made with Brock.

      • Russ

        Obviously if you could guarantee that Keenum wouldn’t have a regression, $20M makes sense. He was stuck in a middling system under Jeff Fischer, and before that didn’t get many opportunities to showcase his stuff, save for his rookie year. But for the most part, he’s improved his numbers every year and had the second highest completion percentage last year (to Wentz). All that said, I have a feeling the Broncos offensive system next year is probably going to be closer to the 2016 Rams than the 2017 Vikings, and to me, Keenum doesn’t seem like the kind of QB who can make a mediocre system much better than mediocre.

        • RSH
          • Steven Searls

            Having Carr as his QB and a good O-line probably helped. That and Amari Cooper was healthy all of 2015.

            Regardless of who we get to be our starting QB, if our line stays the same as last year, we will again struggle on offense. Only Russell Wilson or Aaron Rodgers could make that line look acceptable.

          • RSH

            And the hope is that with a better quarterback and upgrades on our offensive line, our offense will be better. Additionally, Musgrave will be able to implement his system and schemes during OTAs, training camp, and preseason without being thrust into the role of offensive coordinator in Week 12 of the regular season like in 2017.

          • Sparks

            You’re last sentence says it all on Musgrave and the Broncos IMO. Give the guy a full offseason to implement his system. Then if he falters, ok maybe he’s not the guy but I’m not going to judge him for what happened last year after taking over the dumpster fire that was created.

          • BlackKnigh

            Well said! The OL has to be a top priority. That line almost ruined TS. It has to be fixed.
            Hopefully Musgrave will have input on the OL players selected.

          • bradley

            We need a Q!

          • QDoc

            I’m right heeerrrreee…. I can hear you….

            that hurts, bruh.

          • Russ

            Let me guess, he was so creative and exciting that they let him walk? I would argue that Trevor Siemian showed enough wherewithal initially (rookie and second year) to be able to look decent in a good system. We had enough of a sample size of Musgrave last year, IMO, to at least temper our expectations going forward–that applies to whomever our QB is going to be.

          • Russ

            (save for Drew Brees)

          • RSH

            Many felt that Jack Del Rio unnecessarily dismissed Musgrave after the 2016 season. https://www.mercurynews.com/2017/11/24/after-rebuilding-raiders-offense-bill-musgrave-takes-his-shot-with-broncos/. This is similar to the complaints made by quite a few contributors here and throughout Broncos Country concerning Wade Phillips not being retained by the Broncos for 2017.

            The move has been second-guessed by former players in the media as well, including Deion Sanders of the NFL Network and Steve Young on his weekly KNBR (680) show.

            “You go and spend $20 million on a quarterback, bring in (Marshawn Lynch), have two good receivers on the outside — 1,000-yard guys — and you bring in a rookie coordinator to run the ship?,” Sanders said on NFL GameDay Prime. “That’s a disservice. You’re seeing the repercussions from all that right now.”

            Young, who qualified his comments by admitting he’s close friends with Musgrave, said “Billy built something last year that was a top 10 offense with young players, a young quarterback. They had something going and you could feel it. That’s why people expected so much this year. Then they fired him, because they loved Todd Downing and they wanted him to be the guy, and it just hasn’t resonated.”

          • Nick

            Good thing Woods worked out better than Downing.

        • Sparks

          If you’re willing to lay Keenum’s Rams year 100% on Fischer, are you willing to do the same for 2016 TS at VJ’s feet? Totally agree with “Keenum doesn’t seem like the kind of QB who can make a mediocre system much better than mediocre.”

          • Russ

            I’m not putting that 100% on Fischer, but come on, when is the last time an offensive system under the Fischer umbrella been anywhere near effective? And yes, a better system would have helped TS. But you’re making my point for me: let’s say it’s not Fischer’s system, then Keenum is really just a bad QB who had a fluke year. Unfortunately, in today’s QB market, and the fact that the Broncos are desperate, we should all brace ourselves for the inevitability that we are going to overpay for a QB this offseason. Whomever they end up signing, they are going to be earning more than they deserve

          • Sparks

            I don’t know. I think any of the Bridgewater/McCown/Glennon triumvirate would be reasonably priced for what we can expect to get out of them. Might they be overpriced some, sure, but not at the level I think Keenum is going to be. And if they go with any of those 3 and somehow get one of the top 5 rookie QB’s then the position itself would be well under priced for the forseeable future. Unless that rookie Paxton’s it, but that’s a necessary roll of the dice in today’s NFL with rookie QB’s.

          • PiperAR

            TS didn’t play for VJ in 2016. I think TS did what Kubiak and Rico asked in 2016 and protected the ball. (And the numbers prove the notion that TS didn’t throw the ball downfield in 2016 is a myth.). I also think in 2017 TS tried to do what VJ and McCoy ask of him, which was to make plays. That IMO was an error, given the limitations of all QBs on the roster, ball security should have been first priority. Maybe McCoy really thought 30-40 passes was the best way to win or develop Trevor. I don’t blame him or any QB to not speak up and say what his OC asks is beyond his ability to deliver at that point in his career.

            I don’t know enough about the 2016 Rams to know if that’s a good comp or no.

          • Sparks

            Sorry, I meant 2017 TS. Corrected.

    • RSH

      I say no on Keenum as well. He will want too much money to be a stopgap or bridge quarterback. If the Broncos do not sign Kirk Cousins, then I want them to set their sights on Teddy Bridgewater, Josh McCown, or Sam Bradford. Under such a scenario, Denver will more than likely need to select a quarterback early in the draft. I am very intrigued by the Bridgewater-trading back into the first round to select Lamar Jackson combination that was discussed yesterday.

      • Sparks

        Agree with every word you said except 2 – “Sam” and “Bradford”. 🙂 If we need a 3rd FA in case the other two don’t pan out, I’d rather Glennon than Bradford.

        • RSH

          We would just need to select a rookie that is ready to roll if we sign Bradford. He is a much better quarterback than Glennon. Bradford’s problem is he just cannot stay healthy.

          • Sparks

            Can’t stay healthy and probably more expensive.

          • RSH

            If Bridgewater and McCown sign elsewhere, he may be one of the only options left. Bridgewater is no bet to stay healthy either.

          • Sparks

            Let’s just hope it doesn’t come to the last resort option. Agreed on Bridgewater’s health. Of course, it’s his health that may push him into the ‘affordable’ arena for us, so there’s that.

          • Yahmule

            Bradford has stolen money his entire career. Some team will pay him too much again.

            A guy like Mike Glennon would be a decent gamble. He’ll cost next to nothing and his career numbers are better than Keenum’s were before he got to Minnesota.

          • DCJ1

            Please not Glennon. My Bucs-fan buddy would never let me hear the end of it. On the other hand, Glennon’s wife is extremely photogenic, so it would give the camera crews someone to focus on while waiting for the punt team to come on after yet another three and out…

        • Yahmule

          I’ll take a season off if we waste any money on Bradford.

          • ohiobronco

            If they sign Bradford and draft Rosen you would only need to take a few months off.

          • pubkeeper

            I’d put it at a game or two. Bradford’s knees are bone on bone. He was fully recovered this year and couldn’t play a full game because of the pain. If Denver was a coastal city, it’s be better to just put that money in a bottle and throw it in the water, you may get it back that way.

          • bradley

            If he signs for vet minimum and incentives?

          • Yahmule

            He’s demonstrably bad at football.

            Who posted that advanced metric chart that had him worst among quarterbacks with a certain number of career passes recently?

          • RSH

            Bradford’s numbers are respectable, and his completion percentage has been very high the past 31 games that he has played. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BradSa00.htm. In Bradford’s last 17 games, he has thrown for 23 touchdowns and five interceptions. I will concede that his win-loss record leaves much to be desired. Bradford is not my preference, and he will probably be overpaid by some other team, but he is better than what the Broncos have trotted out at quarterback in their past 32+ games.

          • Yahmule

            In 2016, his only good season, he threw a whopping 20 touchdown passes and nine of them came in four games against crappy Packer and Bear secondaries. And, of course, he went 7-8 for a team that won 13 games mostly without him this season. Now they say his knee issues are chronic. I would rather draft Allen than ride this train to nowhere.

    • Jeremy

      My opinions have been fluid, but similar to you, I’m now hoping that we skip expensive free agent qbs and stick to finding our qb in the draft.

      I think the odds of a rookie or stop gap combined with the pieces we’d be able to afford would be a lot higher than going after a veteran and hoping all the other holes shore themselves up somehow.

      With the price of qbs continuing to skyrocket, the payoff for hitting on a rookie qb keeps increasing. This is the riskier move, and if the qb doesn’t pan out we are probably looking at another double digit loss season, but I think the payoff is much greater.

      As the cliche goes, the greatest risk is not taking one.

      • ohiobronco

        For me it’s not as much about the money. That’s only short term and you want to eventually pay the draft pick because it means he’s good. It’s more that history is not kind to veteran QBs moving teams. As far as a long term starter that joined his team as a veteran it’s only Brees this century. You have some that have had medium term success stories like Manning and Warner and Smith and Plummer but they are rare. The odds are really worse than the draft if you look at all the veterans teams have brought in to be their guy. If you look at teams that are consistent contenders and have a truly stable QB position, they pretty much universally drafted their QB.

        • gobroncos

          By all accounts Manning had more success in less time with the Broncos than Brees has had with NO.

          To your general point, I agree. But one of the teams that has managed it? The Broncos. If we can get Cousins, then let’s do it. We’ve already lost Talib which was the biggest thing that gave cap room to get him. I hoped it wouldn’t come to that, but no use crying over spilled milk. We are where we are. Time to move on. Let’s get Cousins, draft QN in the first. Hopefully a RT drops draft day or we pick up one in FA. All of a sudden, or Offense is A LOT better.

          At this point, I trust Elway’s ability to get the veteran QB more than I trust his ability to draft one.

          • FarAwayBroncoFan

            Cousins and Nelson is a good (albeit expensive) plan. But, I am less concerned about Elway’s QB drafting abilities -for one reason: we’ve never drafted at 5 before (and needed a QB). I agree the Oz/Lynch stuff leaves a bad taste, but they weren’t picked in the top 5, they weren’t considered the top QBs those drafts (although arguably, Lynch could have been the 3rd ranked…even so, he was not considered worthy of a top 10 pick)….and those weren’t exactly known as being QB-loaded drafts. This one is, and we’re likely to find a really good one in the 5 slot. That said, we somehow (still) have to fix the oline too.

    • cjfarls

      Agree with this, if TS could actually play consistently at the level Keenum did last year.
      As I’ve said before, the difference between Keenum last year and TS is consistent accuracy. TS too often just plain missed on throws, which either negated big potential gains/TDs to wide-open receivers (I can think of multiple cases to Sanders, at least one to V. Green, etc.) or resulted in game-changing picks (e.g., not throwing far enough outside on out-routes that went for a pick-6, etc.). If it was just a play or 2, all QBs do that…. TS probably “missed” such gamechanging throws a dozen times or more.

      Keenum wasn’t a world-beater last year, but from what I saw, he hit the open guys when they were open.

      TS-level QB play sinks the entire rest of the offense, because even when the WRs get wide open, its not at all a sure thing that it will result in a score/big play. Keenum level play takes you as far as the rest of the offense can go. Cousins makes the offense go somewhat himself (its not like he was surrounded by elite talent in WAS – Keenum/TS both probably had better supporting casts).

      There is certainly the possibility that Keenum regresses… I don’t particularly like the risk for Keenum, especially on a multi-year deal that makes taking a QB at #5 implausible. But sticking with TS seems a far bigger risk if Keenum is available on a shorter term deal.

      • DCJ1

        Vikings have a better OL. They gave up 27 sacks on 527 attempts last year, compared to 52 on 566 attempts by Denver. They were 7th in rushing, compared to Denver’s 12th. In general, to paraphrase Shannon Sharpe, Keenum didn’t scratch the Corvette when he took over the controls. Meanwhile, TS was driving an ‘92 Accord. Not sure Keenum keeps the Accord on the road better than TS when the pinion nuts fall off…

        • cjfarls

          Sure – that is certainly the risk with Keenum.
          That said, TS made some horribly inaccurate throws when his protection was near perfect, so not sure our bad oline totally forgives TS’s ineptitude.
          Keenum will not do as well here as he did in Minny if the oline remains a sinkhole… but its not inconceivable he makes fewer bad game-killing throws as TS did last year.
          Its also possible/probable TS does better if the oline protection improves… but I’m not sure how much I’d bet on that being enough given his demonstrated inaccuracy even when the pocket is clean.

  • royalwithcheese
  • Nick
  • RSH

    https://twitter.com/theMMQB/status/971946999783280642

    [T]he distaste for mediocrity, whether on a micro level in Los Angeles (their cornerback situation) or the macro level in Denver (their entire offense) . . . makes this a beautiful moment in the NFL offseason.

    We are coming off a year where the most situationally aggressive NFL teams—the Eagles, Jaguars and Patriots—all wound up among the league’s final four. Their roster not only churns at the bottom third, but at the top, where premium, in-prime talent gets combined with flexible coaching to create a dominant force.

    There are plenty of general managers in [John] Elway’s position who would dig into the Paxton Lynch pick and watch the franchise slowly sink into deeper water while a base of season ticket holders waits for him to develop. There are plenty of general managers in [Les] Snead’s position who would still be taking a victory lap, clapping back at everyone who scoffed at the hiring of a 31-year-old head coach and the drafting of Jared Goff the year before.

    Neither of these executives will rest. It could very well be their undoing in the end, but at least it will be one hell of a ride.

    • G Mik

      And they referenced Overthecap!

  • TiredOfWinning

    Walterfootball updated his draft yesterday. Lots to like for the Broncos.

    5: Josh Rosen, QB, UCLA
    40: Terrell Edmunds, LB/S, Virginia Tech
    71: Rashaad Penny, RB, San Diego State
    99: Chukwuma Okorafor, OT, Western Michigan
    106: Keke Coutee, WR, Texas Tech
    109: Rashaan Gaulden, CB, Tennessee
    142: Breeland Speaks, DE/DT, Ole Miss
    163: Troy Fumagalli, TE, Wisconsin
    182: Wyatt Teller, G, Virginia Tech

    http://walterfootball.com/draft2018.php

    • Tim

      That’s got to be too good to be true. Rosen and Edmunds? That would be pretty amazing

      • RSH

        That’s Terrell Edmunds, not Tremaine Edmunds. 🙂

        • Tim

          Haha I need way more caffeine! That makes a lot more sense

          • TiredOfWinning

            I made the same mistake. Don’t feel too bad!

    • Steven Searls

      That draft makes sense only if we spend money to upgrade O-line in free agency and do not sign Cousins or Keenum to contract between $20 – $30M apy

    • Tim

      On another note, I feel the Broncos go WR earlier and try to grab one on Day 2. I would be happy with Kirk, Moore, or Washington

    • cjfarls

      If we got Rosen and Edmunds, I’d do cartwheels and a happy dance and not pay attention to the rest of the draft – never mind, see explanation below 🙂

  • Nick
    • Sparks

      Classy.

    • RSH

      If I was a head coach or defensive coordinator, Talib would be one of the first individuals that I would want to interview to be my defensive backs coach once he retires. I could definitely see Talib in broadcasting post-career as well.

      • ohiobronco

        If you’re ever in a playoff game against the Bengals he could come off the bench and draw a critical personal foul for you.

        • RSH

          Yet the Bengals would still manage to lose. 🙂

          • ohiobronco

            Because of the personal foul Talib drew against them while coaching for the other team…

        • WhoShotBobbyHumphrey

          I want to see an Aqib Talib vs Joey Porter, Steel Cage Match!! Guest referee, Adam “Pac Man” Jones.

          • The 5th Amigo

            Micheal Crabtree has thrown a metal folding chair into the cage. It’s carnage ladies and gentlemen .

  • ohiobronco

    Elway to Condon: Got any more HOF QBs coming free? Same deal as last time?
    https://twitter.com/ProFootballTalk/status/972154282702188546

    • Nick

      Brees: How much is Brady making?
      Condon: $20.5 million
      Brees: Then I don’t want…nah, no way I can finish that sentence with a straight face.

    • Jeremy

      Damn

      • Jeremy

        Oh wait, says can not will. Was wondering why this didn’t generate more discussion

        • RSH

          Because WSBH and Michael Jordan told me to stop and get help yesterday. 🙂

        • ohiobronco

          I would think that can means teams will. Why would they not at least shoot over a feeler offer?

    • pubkeeper

      Take all that cash with cousins name on it, here you go drew!

  • Kush-Lash

    Nick, forgive my idiocy if this should be self-explanatory, but why don’t the Broncos pick 5th in each round? For example, how did the Jets, Bucs and Bears all end up ahead of us in the 2nd?

    • The Color Orange

      Per Wikipedia. “Once the order for the first round is determined as described above, the selection order remains the same for subsequent rounds with the exception of teams with identical records within their tier. These tied teams “cycle” picks in each subsequent round. For example, in the 2014 draft, the Jacksonville Jaguars, Cleveland Browns, Oakland Raiders, Atlanta Falcons, and Tampa Bay Buccaneers all finished 4–12, and selected in that order in the first round (based on the tiebreakers described above). In the second round, Jacksonville cycled to the back of the line with the order becoming Cleveland, Oakland, Atlanta, Tampa Bay, and Jacksonville. That cycling continued in each round.”

      • Kush-Lash

        Appreciate it… Sounds like we just didn’t suck enough. lol

        https://goo.gl/images/xRAQz1

        • ohiobronco

          Stupid Osweiler having his one good game in Indy.

    • Nick

      TCO is correct. It’s a four way tie with NYJ, TB & CHI.

      • Kush-Lash

        Not my favorite kind of four way.

  • royalwithcheese
    • bradley

      If they are going to trade him, I hope they can accommodate him and send him somewhere he’s OK with.

      • RSH

        If only Adam Gase wasn’t such a petty bridge burner.

      • G Mik

        I can’t imagine getting something in return for CJ considering his contract and the upcoming draft class. Would be awesome if it happens but highly unlikely.

        • Drewredux

          Something was missing this year, in addition to space to operate. He got gobbled up in a lot of creases he used to clear.

          I don’t see Denver milking a pick out of anybody either.

        • Sparks

          Maybe he could be used to not necessarily get a pick outright but maybe to swap up some rounds or something.

    • Drewredux

      I get it and all, but based on Elway’s gracious mid-season comments about his team’s character, it is supremely ironic that two guys who balled their asses off for every second of every game they played are the first two shoes to drop.

      I’d be worried if I were DT. 😀

      • RSH

        DT is safe this season. John Elway expressly said so at the NFL Combine. There is no way the Broncos have a shot at luring Kirk Cousins here without Thomas.

    • Sparks

      2 months ago I said this guy was going to be a cap casualty to a resounding round of boos. Looks like he’s all but out the door as well. Great guy and wherever he does end up (NFC please), I wish him well.

      • RSH

        I also said as much starting last summer. I appreciate Anderson’s candor, determination, and some of the stellar performances he delivered, particularly against New England in Week 12 of the 2015 season.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1ilf6lij1w

  • WhoShotBobbyHumphrey
  • RSH

    Interesting scheduling nugget from Mike Klis. https://twitter.com/MikeKlis/status/971955860007211008

    The Mexico City game has been played the past two seasons in Week 11. If history holds to form, the Rams would play in Denver Week 10 or 12 in 2018. The Patriots played at Denver in Week 10 last season before their Week 11 game in Mexico City.

    The Rams will play both Peters’ former Chiefs and Talib’s former Broncos this year, possibly in back-to-back weeks. The Rams “host” the Chiefs in Mexico City and because they’ll be playing at high altitude, the NFL is considering have Los Angeles play at Denver either the week prior or week after.

    • Yahmule

      Good year to shop for corners. More starting caliber corners on the market than typical.

    • gobroncos

      Wow, I always forget that Mexico city is so high in elevation. 7382′. That’s 100ft higher than the University of Wyoming.

    • InSiemianWeTrust

      Roby gets trashed by big WR1. Remember when he tried to tackle Alston Jeffrey? Lawl. Hoping he’s up to the task.

  • Andrew

    Hate seeing a great player like Talib go, but am happy that nasty CB tandem is not in the AFC. Stumbled across this gem on twitter this morning classic Talib…
    https://twitter.com/drewsoicher/status/971943100187787264

    • gobroncos

      BWAHAHAHAH!!!! That’s F-ing Hilarious. What was this from? Some game we won?

      “Our plan was to do what we do….
      You know we do….
      …we did….”

      He said everything and nothing at the same time. I can’t tell if that’s just genius or lack of communication skills.

      I’m gonna miss this guy. Wish we never had to get rid of him. I think our defense will suffer this next season and the next. He could cover any of our opponents big receivers. No question.

      Good Luck, Talib (except when you play the Broncos). I just hope he gives up the eye gouging and intentional face mask stuff.

      • Andrew

        Pretty sure that was his reponse to a question about the Crabtree altercation.

      • BlackKnigh

        I will miss him too. You are right about him covering big receivers. He always came to play!!

      • bradley

        “He said everything and nothing at the same time. I can’t tell if that’s just genius or lack of communication skills.”
        My thought exactly.

  • Nick

    I still have no idea what Seattle is doing. Their CBs under contract are now Shaquill Griffin and a bunch of scrubs.

    https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/972175063901491200

    • ohiobronco

      Kind of like what they did to their OL after SB48.

      • Nick

        The Seahawks need a lot more scrutiny against them for that Max Unger/Jimmy Graham trade. That might be worse than when they pissed away a 1st rounder on Percy Harvin.

        • WhoShotBobbyHumphrey

          Rest assured, an intimate group of Seahawk fans, is facing that scrutiny right now.

        • G Mik

          Harvin was a big part of 1 game – the game that mattered most.

          • Nick

            *triggered*

  • Sparks

    End of week Mock – I went into this with assumption that we don’t win the Cousins sweepstakes. I highly doubt my Rd 2 pick would fall that far but I was picking based off of who was available and couldn’t get my card to the podium fast enough. :).

    5: R1P5 G QUENTON NELSON NOTRE DAME
    40: R2P8 QB LAMAR JACKSON LOUISVILLE
    71: R3P7 OT CHUKWUMA OKORAFOR WESTERN MICHIGAN
    99: R3P35 CB RASHAAN GAULDEN TENNESSEE
    106: R4P6 TE HAYDEN HURST SOUTH CAROLINA
    109: R4P9 LB SHAQUEM GRIFFIN CENTRAL FLORIDA
    142: R5P5 DL KENDRICK NORTON MIAMI
    160: R5P23 WR EQUANIMEOUS ST. BROWN NOTRE DAME
    163: R5P26 CB HOLTON HILL TEXAS
    182: R6P8 LB FRED WARNER BRIGHAM YOUNG
    225: R7P7 RB PHILLIP LINDSAY COLORADO

    • Carsonic

      OK, this has me hyperventilating a little.

    • Yahmule

      Not a Chuk fan but I would kill or die for this draft.

    • RSH

      I think a criminal investigation needs to be initiated as to how you swung Jackson at 40, Brown at 160, and Warner 182. 🙂

      • Sparks

        Nice. I did Fanspeak against Bleacher Report: Matt Miller, NFL mock FWIW.

        • RSH

          Classic or Difficult setting?

          • Sparks

            Classic. I’m not that much of a masochist. 🙂

          • RSH

            I always go Difficult, so as to not give false hopes. 🙂

    • BlackKnigh

      Everything here to like. The final touch is Lindsay from CU.
      Denver off to the races this year!

  • Andrew
    • RSH

      You’ve been Disqused by Nick. 🙂

      • Nick

        I did post it near 6:30 in the morning, so easy to miss.

        I’m also impressed with the number of upvotes it got, 25 is very high for this site.

        • Andrew

          I should’ve known that would have made it on here already.

        • DCJ1

          I was amused by the fact that with 25 upvotes, no one felt it needed a comment. It was pretty much the perfect tweet.

  • Nick

    I should work on creating a SQL file to run all the queries I need to run to update all these trades. I believe this is #7 agreed upon before it can be consummated.

    https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/972177721823584256

  • Nick

    Boo, we don’t need any BSU fans here to get tempted to watch Raiders games.

    https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/972188299082203136

    Hopefully he used up all his Black Hole goodness in his rookie season.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=maOX3ju2GPg

  • Yahmule

    I’m wondering how far down the board Josh Jackson’s 40 and Calvin Ridley’s poor showing in the long jump and broad jump will hurt their stock. I think these guys are going to have better careers than most of the Combine superstars at their respective positions.

  • ohiobronco

    https://twitter.com/NathanZegura/status/972189737225281536

    *****”There are no sure things in the NFL Draft…only sure thing is that a Franchise QB matters more than everything else combined”*****

    • Yahmule

      One sure thing is guys who are more interested in partying like Richardson, Vince Young and Manziel fail hard. People didn’t vet Trent well enough to notice the human remora that clung to him. Barkley doesn’t have that problem. The only thing that can keep him from success is injuries.

    • cjfarls

      Richardson was a good prospect, but at no time did I ever think he was a better prospect than AP. If I recall he was smaller, and slower…. maybe I’m mis-remembering, and I really did like Richardson as a prospect… this just seems wrong.

      • Sparks

        I didn’t think Zeke was as good a prospect as AP, let alone Trent. Heck, I don’t even know if Barkley is as good a prospect as AP but he’s certainly close.

        • T. Jensen

          Zeke does have the benefit of running behind a good line. Demarco murray looked amazing behind that too. Now he is just decent.

          • Sparks

            And soon-to-be unemployed.

  • RSH
  • RSH
    • Tim

      No wonder Elway is so set on adding to the WR core. Has there been any talk about adding another TE, whether a FA or through the draft?

      • I would assume they’ll add a TE to the mix, to compete — whether thru draft or (a not expensive ) FA. Also feel like they’re really high on Butt, Butt-high if you will, so maybe that will make them feel less desperate?

      • Jeremy

        What positions aren’t we trying to improve this year? Safety, center, and long snapper are about the only ones I haven’t seen mentioned yet.

        • Sparks

          There were rumblings we were trying to trade for Cravens so you have to take Safety off your list. 🙂

          • Jeremy

            I thought of that after I posted it. At least we are set with Kreiter (watch him get cut after I post this)

          • Nick

            If he’s getting traded to Denver LB would be a more likely position.

      • gobroncos

        Adding to? Sounds more like he’s doubling down on what he has. Every team in the league needs a solid #3. They just don’t come at the price you want. They move up to #2’s and #1’s if they’re solid. Most of those drops were by DT. The rest by ES and then some by whoever’s left.

    • Nick

      Not a good showing by the AFC West there.

    • Jeremy

      Seems at first glance no clear trend among teams with good or bad qbs

      • ohiobronco

        Seems like a bit of a relationship between stronger running teams and fewer drops.

    • BlackKnigh

      New Orleans is markedly better than MIN – who is next.

  • RSH

    Back in the day when I loved watching hoops.

    https://twitter.com/espn/status/972206792372576256

    • John

      What a crazy comeback that was. The 1996 College Hoops season was pretty good (especially because Syracuse ended up in the Final Four).

  • RSH
    • ohiobronco

      Plus higher radar velocity and faster 40 time than #Allthetools Paxton.

    • T. Jensen

      Surely this is inaccurate. While watching the combine, I was led to believe that Josh Allen is a god and could not be blamed for any loss or incomplete pass…

      • DCJ1

        “PFF Is Front For Russian Operatives Messing With NFL Draft”

        Bet that headline would generate righteous indignation amongst those inclined to ignore the meddling that occurred in the 2016 election.

    • Drewredux

      By virtually every measure, he should probably be the guy. I just doubt Denver sees it that way.

      Of course, I haven’t been right about how Denver sees anything for about 7 years. So there’s that.

      • T. Jensen

        I want Mayfield. I hate OU so much my nose just started bleeding as I typed that horrible sentence.

        But I like Denver more than I hate OU and I think he’s the real deal.

        • Drewredux

          I think he has a minor chance of busting spectacularly, but I expect the opposite.

          I’ve only seen one local tweeter express the rumor of Denver interest since the Senior Bowl. I’ve been conditioned to see this is a bad sign.

          I’m not about to get my hopes up.

          • T. Jensen

            All players have a chance of busting. But I too expect the opposite. His immaturity actually translates to competitiveness on the field. (He’s like Philip rivers. He’s going to spurt his mouth off and do stupid crap but he backs it up with play)

            My only really concern is size/durability but if Brees can do it, I don’t see why another player cannot…

          • Drewredux

            It is not rare to see the cockiest guy in the room be the first to fold when shit gets real.

            I doubt Mayfield is that guy. But I do worry about how he will handle adversity, if it comes.

          • T. Jensen

            IMO he has handled it already. He didn’t get much interest out of High School. He picked a school that was a good fit for him, worked hard and earned a starting role. He got hurt and it jeopardized his starting role, so he decided to gamble and re-prove himself at OU.

            Not to mention the games he was behind and took control of the games and led the team to victories. OU was just ok the past couple of years, without Mayfield they lose a lot more games.

            He’s not like Vince Young who had never really lost in high school or college and was thrust onto a losing team. Who couldn’t handle the pressure of losing. (again that hurts to write)

          • Drewredux

            He has been on a Cinderella run awhile. What happens if the coach turns to a pumpkin, even for just a little while?

            Just playing devils advocate here, by the way. We are largely on the same page.

          • T. Jensen

            Totally possible but I feel like he’s at least had some ups and down’s in his life to help him navigate that road.

          • gobroncos

            Elway did say of Mayfield that he didn’t need to break the mold (because of his height, probably), that it had already been broken (probably referring to players like Brees and Russel Wilson).

          • Broncos777

            Brees is really small too. I stood next to him at the Hall of Fame game this year. He looks 6’0″ 190ish. I couldn’t believe that he is a QB in the NFL.

          • pubkeeper

            I don’t know, drew. I’m 50/50 on that. There’s the telegraph that was Bolles last year, but they also showed no interest in Ray before taking him too

          • Drewredux

            Yes, I’m guilty of a little hyperbole there.

            To their credit this year, the water remains very, very murky as to their general intentions.

          • T. Jensen

            I think that has to do with the FA market. I mean we all know their intentions are to get a new QB. But who that will be is the big question.

      • Yahmule

        Weird that Mayfield and Rosen are still being forced to deal with this over scrutinization of their personalities.

        • cjfarls

          If it pushes one of the them to #5 and we don’t get Cousins… awesome.

        • Drewredux

          I’ve never understood it with Rosen whatsoever.

          As I’ve said before, Oklahomans were the last to learn that Baker Mayfield is some reincarnation of Johnny Manziel as a person.

          Mayfield, in my own personal opinion, is good cocky. But I can understand evaluators being worried that he’s the wrong kind of cocky.

    • Tim

      Saints have scheduled 3 meetings with him. I really want to know why and how they could realistically get him

  • InSiemianWeTrust

    Ramczyk: “During the final eight games (including both playoff matchups) he surrendered just one quarterback hit and no sacks.”

    Shet.

    • JMac

      He is so un-interested in football, he wanted to make sure there were no sacks to show as highlights… Now THAT’s commitment to not loving a sport!

    • SterlingMalloryArcher

      God damn it. I wanted him badly.

    • BlackKnigh

      He probably contributed a bunch to Brees completions and low number of drops by his receivers.

    • RSH

      I wonder if Ramcyzk would have played as well while blocking for three different quarterbacks in his final eight games as opposed to a Super Bowl winning—and potential Hall of Fame—quarterback.

      • Yahmule

        If we had Ramczyk, maybe we don’t cycle through three stiffs because Siemian doesn’t become a shell shocked mess.

        The Broncos picked the wrong guy and chose against the tackle most here wanted and they made the choice for really dumb reasons, but we’re stuck with the results.

  • RSH
  • Yahmule

    Martin Shkreli is in court crying and begging like a bitch as he’s sentenced to seven years for defrauding investors. He was smirking and laughing while he was raising the price of the life saving drug Diaprim from $13 to over 700 bucks. Like Madoff, he screwed up by stealing from people with money. He could have continued sentencing people made destitute by medical bills to death indefinitely.

    • InSiemianWeTrust

      We’ve decided, as a society, that medicine should not be a vehicle for pure profiteering. However, as is often stated in the nonprofit realm, “No margin, no mission.” Clearly there is a balance.

      When 18% of our GDP is dedicated to healthcare, there’s plenty of room for worms like Shkreli to make a dime. Meanwhile, the US continues to deliver low value, expensive care.

      • DCJ1

        There are plenty of challenges with drug development. First and foremost, the trials and testing that it takes to get a drug to market is as horribly expensive as it is required. It is about $2.6B to get a drug to market, and then the company has a short window (sometimes just a couple of years) before it goes to generics. That leads to the odious push to sell brand name drugs to the general public. The price is also set horribly high so that insurance companies pay a hospital $200 per aspirin, which allows the pharma to recoup costs while spreading the $$ across the insured population.

        After a drug goes generic, there are other weird things. The oddest is that original pharma often will sell excess stock to the generics company (Couple that with the up to 40% difference in formulation, with a generic you have no idea what you’re getting). Thus the truly egregious thing about the Diaprim is not only did he buy the patents, he also bought the excess pill stock. He could have made a profit without raising the price a penny, because the pills were already a sunk cost and he had no need to manufacture a thing.

        It is a shame he was nailed for stealing from the rich rather than profiteering. But sadly the immoral loophole he exploited is there to help keep the drug companies in business creating some level of life-saving drugs rather than having them all convert to making boner pills.

        • Sparks

          It might not have been the intent but your last line made me lol.

        • FarAwayBroncoFan

          While what you say is true, I can tell you that I’ve had to deal with PhRMA on a few occasions, and those guys are rolling in the dough, and are amazingly clueless. They have the nicest boardroom I’ve ever seen – their conference table, for example, was for sure from some majestic old growth forest that’s been capriciously gutted. Their chairs put you to sleep almost instantaneously. Their sound system, state of the art.

          And then, when they would come overseas, asking countries to not sell generics or to not put caps on pharmaceutical prices, using the argument that they had to recoup all the money they spend on R&D…they’d come in wearing Armani and Rolexes. Fucking clueless. Needless to say, these guys rarely convinced their host governments to change their price structure.

    • Jeremy

      I rarely talk politics, but I highly recommend people read “An American Sickness”, which examines in depth how bad the health care system has become

    • He got off EASY considering how much misery he caused and his whole line of corruption, as you note. He’s an immoral ghoul. Hope he rots in there.

  • Nick

    Might be the end of the line for an old friend.

    https://twitter.com/AndrewSiciliano/status/972216322636505088

    • Yahmule

      We could draft James Washington who has a similarly freakish build as a tribute.

    • royalwithcheese

      Not sure why. Bring him back to Denver.

    • MattR

      I wonder how often a GM has to cut a player he was teammates with during his playing days.

  • InSiemianWeTrust

    Mike Evans just got a 5y 16M APY. Deal.

    Isn’t a QB easily worth twice as much as a WR?

    • Jeremy

      Fairly similar production to Sanders, who some wanted to cut to save $5.5 million.

    • Tim

      There are going to be a lot of teams upset about that deal and a lot of WR extremely happy

    • Hercules_Rockefeller

      Let’s hope the Saints leave it to the last minute and then their fax machine breaks!

  • InSiemianWeTrust

    Browns trade for Landry.

    • Tim

      There’s no way the Browns were dumb enough to give up the #4, right? That could severely hurt the Broncos chance of grabbing a top QB

      • Tim

        Nevermind, Schef said they weren’t 1st or 2nd picks. Can never be too sure if it being the Browns!

        • Jeremy

          Says they weren’t the Browns first or second pick, or that they weren’t a first or second round pick?

          • Tim

            1st or 2nd round, my bad

      • Nick
        • Yahmule

          Nice. That’s a great guy to have on that team. They badly need a playmaker they can count on week after week. He’ll certainly be a better role model for their young receivers than Kenny Britt.

    • cjfarls

      They gotta spend the cash on someone.

    • RSH
  • RSH
    • Jeremy

      Shelby will be an RFA next year, correct? I imagine he’ll earn the second round tender if he picks up where he left off

      • Nick

        Correct.

  • WhoShotBobbyHumphrey
    • pubkeeper

      Brown’s stocking up. Barkley going number one now.

      • WhoShotBobbyHumphrey

        For sure.

    • BlackKnigh

      Good deal for the Browns. Wonder if they will still pick a QB in the first 4 picks.

      • WhoShotBobbyHumphrey

        I would think they would be considering a trade down at 4.

    • FarAwayBroncoFan

      Ugh. Well, that means they’ll likely deal one of their picks to a QB needy team.

      • WhoShotBobbyHumphrey

        Yup.

      • MattR

        With all the draft capital and cap space they still have, they can almost justify taking a QB at 4 and letting him sit a year or two behind Taylor.

    • cjfarls

      Interesting move. Seems unlikely they take a QB in the first anymore unless they already are ready to give up on Kizer.
      As the Browns, I would have either gone hard for Cousins, or taken a QB at 1 or 4 to compete with Kizer.
      Adding a mediocre QB makes 3 unsure things, which I’m not sure is any better than 2 unsure things.

      • Steven Searls

        They gave up on Kizer. Have to assume they will draft one of the QBs.

    • Nick

      This really disappoints me. Taylor was my preferred veteran QB after Cousins. It also takes the Browns out of AJ McCarron, someone I’m not that thrilled for, and I’m now worried that Denver will be interested in him.

      That being said, beating the Browns’ offer of the first pick in the 3rd round may have been too rich for me.

      • WhoShotBobbyHumphrey

        If we signed Tyrod (my next best option after Cousins too), would you still have taken a QB in the 1Rd? If not, a 3rd doesn’t seem like that big of a waste.

        • Nick

          Cousins is the only QB I would categorically foreclose using the #5 pick on a rookie QB.

  • RSH
  • JMac

    I would not hate being in their position:
    https://twitter.com/FieldYates/status/972255107197886476

    • bradley

      GO BROWNS!

    • RSH

      Now, select Josh Allen and Minkah Fitzpatrick.

    • Very cool. I like what the Browns are doing.
      Now this changes complexion of draft a bit no?
      Have to think they’ll be smart and start the draft with Barkley, and maybe go another position with their other pick. QBs may tumble.

      • Well I see people have already discussed this below. Ha. But anyway, yeah, this is another reminder why mock drafts before trades and free agency are basically a waste.

    • Hank Mardukis

      It’s the Browns. They’ll find a way to fuck this up.

    • Yahmule

      Markedly better than what we have at the same positions here in Denver, especially when CJ is gone.

  • Kwash

    Browns traded Kizer to Packers. They’re still picking a QB. No idea how to imbed a tweet…
    https://twitter.com/rapsheet/status/972256154565955584?s=21

    • InSiemianWeTrust

      Brett Hundley is donzo.

      • Broncos should just pick him up and draft Josh Rosen and go for the all-UCLA QBs! 😉
        Oh and sign ’90s Troy Aikman.

        • Bring Tommy Maddox out of retirement?

  • InSiemianWeTrust

    Hold up, did the Browns give their 3rd for Tyrod?

    • Kwash

      Yep. It reportedly “easily trumped” Broncos and Cardinals offers.

    • MattR

      #65, leaving them only 1,4,33,35 and 64 in the top 75.

      EDIT: The Landry trade is being reported as a 4th this year and 7th next year, but not sure if that 4th is 101 or 123 overall

      • BlackKnigh

        Not a bad hand to hold. They could make it richer if Buffalo wants to trade up with their 2 1st round picks.

        • MattR

          Almost enough to make a Browns fan optimistic, which will make their continued ineptitude that much more painful.

  • InSiemianWeTrust

    Bills are going to have to trade up or go Peterman (to state the obvious). Don’t think they’re winning the FA competition. Wonder which QB they have their eyes on.

    • Nick

      They really need to hope that either the Broncos or Jets get Cousins to definitively take them out of the rookie QB market, and then hope again that either team is willing to trade with them.

  • InSiemianWeTrust

    McCarron for 14 APY or Keenum for 20 APY?

    • royalwithcheese

      No.

      • InSiemianWeTrust

        John: Good answer. Allen it is!

    • Yahmule

      McCarron. Easy.

      • Kwash

        Agreed.

        • Yahmule

          In fact, with the Browns out on him now, I strongly wish this would be our number two choice.

          • royalwithcheese

            Even if it means they take a QB at 5 (or higher)?

          • Yahmule

            Not how I would play it but probably.

          • Steven Searls

            Well life sure got more interesting after today. I just hope we don’t trade away our No. 1 next year to move up a spot or two because I suspect we will be drafting in the top 10 again.

          • Jason

            Could be a dark horse, depending on the Cousins Mega Ball.

          • FarAwayBroncoFan

            He’s got what 4 starts in 3 years? No, thanks. I’d rather roll with McCown and a totally blank slate draft pick.

          • Yahmule

            He was blocked.

            Compared to $20M APY for Keenum or the other veteran options, I like him better. I don’t see him exceeding $15M APY in this market and we can structure the deal so it’s not too onerous to bail.

          • FarAwayBroncoFan

            Oh I get it, and totally agree on Keenum, but I am just skeptical he’s going to have a better career than any of the top 3 QBs drafted this year.

          • Yahmule

            I’m deeply conflicted. I understand the value of a top QB on a rookie contract, but how many of these top five quarterbacks are going to make it? I see Nelson, Barkley, Fitzpatrick and Chubb as much safer picks and almost certainly players who will make a more immediate impact.

          • BlackKnigh

            If you are a betting man – you might bet on 50% of them. The tough part is which ones are which. I would pick Darnold, Mayfield and Jackson. Rosen pretty good. Allen average and my gut tells me to stay away from Rudolph. Not sure why.
            I agree with the OL, DL, LB and DBs as safer bets. I think each of those 3 will become all pros some day. Especially Nelson. I shy away from RBs in the high rounds. There are so many things that can go wrong for a young RB.

          • FarAwayBroncoFan

            I agree. I do think those non-QBs are for sure safer bets to be sure things. But how many Super Bowls we win with Champ Bailey? Does Von win one without Manning? I just think we just have to get a franchise lifting QB. As both you and BlackKnigh say, choosing a QB is not a safe pick, but the top of the draft is probably truly our best chance. Now, we just gotta pick Elway/Marino and not Eason/Blackledge.

          • BlackKnigh

            I have read or heard from someone who works with the Broncos that they always want to go into the draft with a team that they could put on the field. It doesn’t have to be perfect – but it would be whole. That keeps them from drafting for need – which is probably what they did last year with Bolles.
            That said – they will most likely really work to put a QB on the roster who could start for them. If they end up with Eli Manning – then they need to pick a good QB early. If they end up with McCarron or Cousins – probably will not need one unless later in the draft.
            You make a very good point and I agree that this is a marvelous opportunity to get a very good QB. Elway probably said that 2 years ago before he picked Lynch. I think he is a little snakebit.
            But if we pick a very good QB and fail to fix the OL and make sure the run game works – we will not have made any progress.

    • Jeremy

      I hate to be a downer, but 14 APY seems very optimistic for McCarron. Both Osweiler and Glennon had much worse resumes, and Osweiler got 18 APY (20.5 APY adjusted for cap inflation) and Glennon got 15 million APY (15.9 million adjusted for cap inflation).

      Maybe the additional free agents will cool the market some, but I think something in the 18 million APY range is more realistic.

      • InSiemianWeTrust

        I said 14 as I’m hoping teams have learned from Os and Glennon… maybe not though!

      • ohiobronco

        Seems to me that those guys had stronger pro resumes. He would make a great QB2, I’m struggling to see the appeal as the starter.

        • Jeremy

          http://pfref.com/tiny/hexjk

          Here’s the comparison between the three. McCarron had the better completion percentage, passer rating any/a, and int percentage.

          McCarron played the least out of the three, but honestly in this wacky qb market that drives up his value

    • FarAwayBroncoFan

      Neither.

    • royalwithcheese

      You’re assuming Cousins is out because they tried to trade for TT?

    • DCJ1

      I’m still not convinced that either rise above journeyman level. Seems like a very Houston thing to do…

      • Agreed. But McCarron at $14m is far less Houston-like, and more palatable.

        • Yahmule

          I agree. McCarron started 40 games @ Alabama and you never saw him flinch in high pressure games. Oz was another traits prospect with very limited experience as a starter.

          • Drewredux

            …and that spectacular 1st half, in Denver, under the bright lights, in a game that mattered big time…

      • BlackKnigh

        Wonder what happens if Denver signs one of them with TS on the roster – and TS plays lights out as the better QB?

        • Jeremy

          You play Trevor and move on from whoever you signed?

    • Drewredux

      McCarron

    • royalwithcheese

      I’d rather have Teddy or McCown at $10M.

    • BlackKnigh

      If Denver got McCarron – they would have a fairly durable QB for quite some time. They simply need to build a solid OL and run game – and restore the defense to the stellar one it was 2 and 3 years ago.
      That said – at this stage – I would be surprised to see Cousins in Denver.

  • Jason

    What kind of contract will Sherman command?

    • Jeremy

      I’m guessing, but I’ll guess something in the 8-10 APY range, and something that is longer term with lower guarantees. I’m guessing Sherman is the type who will want to bet on himself and sacrifice the guarantees for a higher APY.

      I’m guessing teams will want to go with a longer deal, so they’ll keep Sherman at an affordable rate if he does regain his 2012-2015 level of play.

  • Piglet62

    Still room on the UVA bandwagon. Just saying.

  • Nick

    So…I guess I thought I could get away with spending a Friday afternoon with family before the deluge hits, and then the Browns decide to go apeshit with trades. I got some catching up to do.

    • DCJ1

      Browns apparently decided they suck at drafting…

      • Yahmule

        Will it matter if we’re 30 minutes into round one and they’re sitting on Barkley and Chubb?

        • MattR

          What are the odds that one of Rosen, Mayfield and Darnold fall into the teens giving the Browns a chance to trade 33 and 35 to move back up? Or Lamar Jackson lasting into the 20’s where they can trade 33 or 35 with 64 to move up? That seems more likely. Barkley, Chubb, Jackson and then an offensive tackle with the remaining pick (33/35) would be pretty nasty. They wouldn’t pick again until 114 but they would still have 5 picks on day 3 and they should still have the cap space to sign veterans for depth or special teams if need be (I am thinking of all those 4th-7th year players who end up out of the league because they offer equal/slightly better production as an incoming rookie but cost two-three times as much and don’t have “upside”)

          • Yahmule

            I would definitely try to come out of this draft with three first rounders, like they did last year. I would consider moving one or four, but probably wouldn’t drop out of the top 10.

          • MattR

            Personally, because they have the three second rounders (and two of them are essentially first rounders talent-wise, though they do lose the fifth year option) I would keep 1 and 4 to make sure you get two absolute studs. They should still have plenty of ammo to get back into the first round if they want to – I think after all the trades they have 33, 35, 64, 114, 150, 159, 175, 219 (though it could be 138 and 172 instead of 150 and 159 – depending on which 5th round pick they swapped with GB). Of course, if the right offer comes along to drop a couple spots from 4 I would still do it, but that offer is going to have to be a bit sweeter than it had been in years past since there are no longer as many gaping holes to fill.

  • DCJ1

    Just musing, but picking up Taylor and dumping Kizer makes me suspect we’ll see the Browns take Barkley at 1 and Mayfield at 4. With that combo, the Browns fans are going to contract collective amnesia about every QB back to Kosar.

    • Steven Searls

      It means if there is a specific QB we want in the draft we will need to jump the Browns at 4. Which may very well end up being the case. I fear the QB we will jump up for is Josh Allen.

      • Drewredux

        I think if Kubes has any real influence, Allen is 3 on the list. Tops.

        • Steven Searls

          Guess we’ll find out soon enough.

        • PiperAR

          John, no. John!

  • Nick
  • Yahmule

    In honor of our leader, I went Nick heavy in this mock.

    1/5: G QUENTON NELSON NOTRE DAME
    2/40: WR CHRISTIAN KIRK TEXAS A&M
    3/71: DL TIM SETTLE VIRGINIA TECH
    3/99: CB NICK NELSON WISCONSIN
    4/106: RB NICK CHUBB GEORGIA
    4/109: LB SHAQUEM GRIFFIN CENTRAL FLORIDA
    5/142: WR EQUANIMEOUS ST. BROWN NOTRE DAME
    5/160: LB FRED WARNER BRIGHAM YOUNG
    5/163: OT GEORGE SENAT WAGNER
    6/182: TE JORDAN AKINS CENTRAL FLORIDA
    7/225: DL NATHAN SHEPHERD FORT HAYS STATE

    • InSiemianWeTrust

      If you were to run this back, would you take Griffin before St. Brown?

      • Yahmule

        With Kirk already on board, I probably would. Griffin, St Brown and especially Shepherd are pipe dreams at these drafts spots, IMO. :~)

        That George Senat is an intriguing project. Green as grass former basketballer, but 36 inch arms and pretty decent feet.

    • WhoShotBobbyHumphrey

      We traded for Nick Foles?! Yes!!

      • Yahmule

        Nick Folk and Hardy Nickerson, too.

        • WhoShotBobbyHumphrey

          Who are, people that played for Tampa Bay? I love sports Jeopardy!

  • Yahmule

    The Rockies resigned Carlos Gonzalez because sentimentality is always more important than getting your best players on the field.

    • That’ll be one lefty heavy lineup. Tough vs RHP but when they face the Kershaws and Bumgarners of the division…?

      • Yahmule

        Every OF on the team save Desmond (another dumb signing) is a lefthanded hitter. When it comes to Gonzalez, the worst LHP in the league dominate him and he’ll bring his terrible defense back to that spacious outfield for another season. Sorry young pitching staff that already has to pitch in Coors Field.